SPEAKER_00: 0:20

Well, I have a fantastic guest back. Micah Rickerts has returned. And today we're going to dive into why you should use an architect versus not use an architect if you're looking to build a house. And we're going to talk about pros and cons and yeah, the challenges that we see. So hello, Micah. Welcome back.

SPEAKER_01: 0:39

Hi, thanks for having me again.

SPEAKER_00: 0:40

Thank you so much for returning. It's always nice to see people back. And for those that missed out, we've um recorded an awesome episode with Micah about who he is, what he's done. And today we're going to dive a little bit deeper into our subject. So I built three houses.

SPEAKER_01: 0:58

And well, I mean, that's no mean feat.

SPEAKER_00: 1:01

Thank you. And they got bigger and bigger each time. And the last one I have that we're sitting in right now, it's 350 square meter home.

unknown: 1:08

Wow.

SPEAKER_00: 1:09

I know.

SPEAKER_01: 1:10

Hang on, do the maths. It's seven times my place, I think.

SPEAKER_00: 1:13

Yeah, lots of cleaning. Lots of cleaning. I think I've got like four or five bathrooms, toilets, etc., because I have so many kids and I was sick of them hogging it, you know, in a previous house. So the previous house we built, it was actually functional, it was four bedroom, and versatile homes have built that house for me. And what I've noticed is that I never dealt with architects. I only dealt with a salesperson. The salesperson came in, he said, What do you want? I said, This is the section. And lucky for me at the time, the section we bought the first time was quite a big section as well. It was a thousand square meters.

SPEAKER_01: 1:47

Right. So really sizable, yeah. The beauty of 10 times mine.

SPEAKER_00: 1:52

The beauty of Carpeti versus Wellington. We actually have a little bit of land around.

SPEAKER_01: 1:56

Yes.

SPEAKER_00: 1:56

And we're talking what, 10 years ago, right? That's when I was building the first house. And the beauty of that at the time was we only had two kids, and I thought, cool, four-bedroom house will be perfect because it gives me a bedroom, the kids can share, and then eventually they can have one bedroom each. And then my mom comes and goes, so she can have a bedroom. And I didn't think certain things through. And I feel like sometimes maybe it was a salesman job or not. But if I had an architect that knew what they were doing, the build would have turned out a bit better planned. Because when the house was built and I was in the house and I came out of a shower and I was standing in my bedroom, I realized the hallway and the front door was facing the street outside of my bedroom. So basically the whole neighborhood could see me as I was coming in and a shower if my kids left the front door open, which they often did at that age because they were just running in and out all the time. So that was a massive eye-opener of the floor. Floor, of the floor of the floor plan.

SPEAKER_01: 3:03

The floor of the floor plan. I quite like that.

SPEAKER_00: 3:06

Yes. So I wish I knew you back then, because I'm sure you would have built me a slightly smarter home.

SPEAKER_01: 3:12

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 3:13

Well. Let's talk about that. So at what point do people use an architect?

SPEAKER_01: 3:18

Yeah, well, there are a few ways you can sort of look at it. And the primary skills of an architect is that we're not only people that study space and design and the physical nature of a building, but we're also really versed in navigating the rules and the complexity of building itself. And it's not to be underestimated how much risk and money and complexity is involved with building even a really simple or small house. It's it's no mean feat, actually. And so an architect is versed in managing that process as well as managing the physical design aspects, such as designing out the floors and the floor plans, like you mentioned before, such as the corridor that opens straight onto the onto the bathroom and the front door. So in a nutshell, when there's a complex project, there's a real benefit to having an architect on board. And complexity doesn't just mean big. I can give an example of a very small project that I have on at the moment, which is the conversion of a lower floor of a large house into a separate flat. It's only 40 square meters. It's tiny, but it's doing my head in. It's a really complex project. And I love this challenge, but we're navigating a brick structure. We're navigating light and dampness. It's facing south, dug into the hill. We've got fire rating to deal with because the New Zealand building codes are very stringent around spread of fire between lower flats and upper flats. We've got thermal issues, we've got damp roofing issues, we've it's a very, very complex project. And then you add the bricks on top of that and the inherent structural problems with earthquakes of bricks. This tiny little place is a minefield of things to go wrong. And so I might show a client a floor plan at the end of it, but before I've even put pen to paper, I'm grappling with all of these issues in the back of my head. So that just gives you a sort of snapshot of the things that are going on in my head in order to get to what might look like a very simple set of plans or construction drawings.

SPEAKER_00: 5:44

Yeah. No, I love that. Can you tell me the difference? What is the difference between an architect and a drafts person? Is it the same difference?

SPEAKER_01: 5:53

Uh well the terminology draftsman, I guess, is sort of gets merged with architectural technician and various other things. So architects have to go have a very stringent legal definition. I don't want to go into the sort of boring legal aspects of that, but in other words, we're regulated by a board. We have to we have a serious certification process we need to go through that covers everything from design to the environment to all of the regulations as well as building ethics and dealing transparency with builders and clients. So draftspeople or technicians haven't necessarily gone through that process and uh haven't necessarily had the I guess the exposure to the broader management of projects. So I'm not saying that there are some incredibly talented and capable uh technicians and draftspeople and but I guess the the the terminology architect really sort of speaks to that that deeper managerial formation that we've been through.

SPEAKER_00: 7:04

Okay.

SPEAKER_01: 7:05

So you mentioned as we were chatting informally before the podcast, before we hit record, it's getting a GP to do some brain surgery or and there's not to be little GPs or anything like that. And they're very good at their job, but there's a layer of complexity and in-depth, I guess, diagnosis and understanding that uh different layers of building require. And generally, the more complex the build, the more an architect will bring value to the table in terms of managing your stress levels, managing your risk, getting the most out of your land, building something that really works for you in the long term. People will like I deal in the residential sector, and people will generally, I know you've built three houses, but generally people will only build one in their lifetime, or it's the biggest asset that they've done. And so it's really important to get this right. It's really important to take the time in this huge process and this huge investment to get the details right. And yeah, that's where an architect's skill and care comes into play.

SPEAKER_00: 8:13

I love that. It's really interesting because you're right, like most of the people that I know would have only built one and they're like, this is our forever home, we're gonna stay here, or they would have hated the build process and they would have gone, This is too much stress, we don't want to go through this again.

SPEAKER_01: 8:27

It can't be underestimated.

SPEAKER_00: 8:29

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 8:30

I had a really interesting project with a client in Westport. So she was originally from Westport, had lived overseas in and also in Wellington and Auckland, and she bought this piece of land, a large piece of land in suburban Westport. And she could have quite happily, I think, put a versatile homes or something similar, gone to a building company and and and built on her site. But the actual site on the face of it wasn't overly complex. But she came to me because A, she wanted something, I think, slightly different and more tailored to her new retired outlook. And she really wanted it to work for her and her particular sort of social structure, living beside friends and and being a being a west coaster. But also, Westport had floods very recently, as perhaps our listeners will remember.

SPEAKER_00: 9:29

It's one of the most uninsurable places in New Zealand at the moment.

SPEAKER_01: 9:32

And so we needed to make sure that when building her house, that we took into account the floodplains and built a resilient house for her. We couldn't just plop a one of the standard floor plans on her site. There would be huge risks, it would be a big mistake to do so. And so we really needed to take into account these flooding issues. But also, interestingly, we raised the house up, but because they were going into retirement, we needed to be really careful. We couldn't just put stairs everywhere. We couldn't, we, we, we needed to that that aspect of accessibility needed care for her as well. And so there were these two opposing factors: lifting a house, but also having good access to the land and her garden for a retired couple. So that was a real process and a real juggle. And I think we got there in the end, and we've delivered a really beautiful house that incidentally has had a bit of media coverage as well recently.

SPEAKER_00: 10:34

So, anyway, that's that's just a snapshot of I love how humble you are about your work because uh you are that multi-award-winning architect. That's kind of you. So I'm gonna introduce you from going forward. Oh god. But it's incredible to hear for me, especially because I do insurances as well for clients, right? Okay. And for me, it's awesome to hear that architects like you are thinking about the future because the weather is just gonna get worse and worse for certain parts, and we've already seen that. And the weather events, you know, just not gonna be kind to the houses. And if you are spending so much money building something and this is your most significant asset, you want to make sure you're future-proofing it. Yeah, so yeah, this is so awesome to hear that hopefully this lady, you know, wouldn't have any issues going forward, and then insurance will be happy to cover her as well.

SPEAKER_01: 11:34

Yeah, yeah. So she has insurance. Uh there and yeah, when she moved in, she she she found an insurer that we we talked through the technical aspects of how the house has been raised up above the floodplain, and and yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 11:50

No, this is awesome.

SPEAKER_01: 11:51

What was interesting there, like you you talked about how you hear stories and and I hear them all the time of like just disaster projects and and people bleeding money or it being really stressful. This particular client, she she's a a a woman of real energy, and she has a she adopted a child with significant disabilities, and uh who her husband was also going through dementia while we were building this house.

SPEAKER_00: 12:20

Wow.

SPEAKER_01: 12:21

And so she had a lot on her plate, and thanks, I think, to the fantastic builder, uh Quinlan Build, Ralph, and myself working with Ralph and her, like we had a really great working, working synergy situation synergy. And she said, Oh, the house is the least of my worries. So yeah, it doesn't have to be a stressful process. And and I I think through through care, managing expectations, managing things such as the council costs, talking through issues and just being really transparent, troubleshooting through looking ahead, dealing with issues before they've even become issues, like you smooth builds do exist. And and I think that's also some of the benefit that uh that uh that an architect can bring.

SPEAKER_00: 13:16

Yeah, and thinking ahead, right? Like thinking about things up front versus facing them as an issue. As an issue when the council comes and says, Oh, you shouldn't have done XYZ.

SPEAKER_01: 13:26

Yeah. Okay. Yeah, or yeah. Yeah, in a nutshell, I think that that hits the money on the head.

SPEAKER_00: 13:33

So money on the head. That's a good one.

SPEAKER_01: 13:35

Oh, that's yeah, for a mortgage uh advisor.

SPEAKER_00: 13:38

That's a good one. You promised to tell me about the Walker Walker box. Walker box and the story for that. Yeah. Do you do we want to do a separate episode for that or do we want to include this in here?

SPEAKER_01: 13:52

I'll give you a snapshot now, shall I?

SPEAKER_00: 13:54

Alright, give me a snapshot.

SPEAKER_01: 13:55

So many Wellington people will know the name Roger Walker, perhaps. He's an architect who did the knotty houses of the 70s with drainpipe windows, fanciful colours, crazy roofs. When you drive out to Wellington Airport, just after the Mount Vic Tunnel, there is this motley knotty house on the left-hand side. It's a bunch of apartments. I think a lot of people will know it. A lot of your listeners as they drive out will know this place. And when I was a kid, I was given a book of his architecture. I think I was all of 12 or something like that. And it really inspired me. And I was like, look at these crazy houses with turrets, and just it was super inspiring for a child. And my dad used to uh actually take me out on the weekends and we'd go looking for these houses. I was so enamored with them. And we'd maybe see a turret in the trees, and we'd go, Oh, I think there's one down this street. And sometimes the owners would even show us through. So here was I, this sort of wide-eyed 11, 12, 13-year-old, like looking really interested in these houses by Roger Walker. And so when it came time to do my house, it wasn't explicit. I didn't set out to do a Walker house. In fact, it's actually quite different, but I can see looking back, it's got so many elements of his sort of joyful aliveness, like just threaded through it, like the staircase, the pops of colour, the finial, the way the light comes in, the the quirky little bathroom with pink tiles. And so, yeah. So when we came to the end, I was like, we have to call it the Walker Box. It's a box. None of Roger Walker's houses are boxes, but it's got all these background elements to it, and it's it's just kind of a nice way to just nod, I think, to the influence that he had on me from when I was a kid.

SPEAKER_00: 15:47

I love this. This is beautiful. Kind of cute, like it is really cute. Do you have a blurb about it on your website?

SPEAKER_01: 15:53

Yeah, there's a there is a story about how it came to be known as the Walker Box. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 15:59

That's awesome. I love history. I honestly, one of my favorite subjects is history because I think if we look into the history, we learn a lot. And there is a lot we can bring into the future.

SPEAKER_01: 16:11

Yeah, that's so true.

SPEAKER_00: 16:13

And one of the phrases I came across recently, I was reading Nigel Lata's book, the latest book he's done before he passed away, unfortunately. And he put in there that all the good thoughts have already been thunk. Right. You know, and that's the truth in a way. Like all the great, all the great things have already been done. It's just how we take them and then how we redo them.

SPEAKER_01: 16:36

And yeah, and it's our experiences from both when we were young and getting older that shape these in just my different ways and yeah, in some ways create something new.

SPEAKER_00: 16:46

I love it. That's a really cool story. Thank you so much, Micah. I would love to learn a little bit around AI and how AI is affecting your industry.

SPEAKER_01: 16:57

Ah, great. Okay. Yes.

SPEAKER_00: 16:59

Yes. And you're gonna come back.

SPEAKER_01: 17:02

We can come back and we can talk about this. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_00: 17:05

Guys, thank you so much for listening in. And if you are curious about Micah, head over to our previous episode and also to his website where you can contact him. He works with clients from all over New Zealand. So don't worry if you're not in Wellington. Thank you so much.

SPEAKER_01: 17:18

Thank you, Zebuniso. See you soon. Brilliant. Bye.