Speaker 1: 0:28

Hello Ben.

Speaker 2: 0:30

Hello Zubaniso, how are you?

Speaker 1: 0:32

I'm wonderful, thank you. How are you, my friend?

Speaker 2: 0:33

I'm great.

Speaker 1: 0:34

It's been a while.

Speaker 2: 0:35

It has.

Speaker 1: 0:36

How are you feeling?

Speaker 2: 0:37

Good, good, yeah, very good.

Speaker 1: 0:39

Thank you so much for coming along when I thought about people I want to have on this podcast. The reason for this podcast is to share the message of hope right, and when I think of hope and when I think of determination, you always come to my mind.

Speaker 2: 0:55

Oh, thank you.

Speaker 1: 0:56

You were just an amazing client and over time you know we've become more than I think client broker relationship. But you're always at the back of my head and I think we made some interesting things happen in your life and this is why you're here today.

Speaker 2: 1:10

Very much so yes.

Speaker 1: 1:11

So I want you to share your story as much as you like with our listeners today about your journey into the home ownership.

Speaker 2: 1:20

Okay. Take it away From the very beginning.

Speaker 1: 1:23

From the very beginning. Once upon a time.

Speaker 2: 1:25

So when I was born, no.

Speaker 2: 1:28

So back in 2015, I had the decision whether to buy a house or buy a business, and obviously hindsight is a wonderful thing because a house would have been the smarter option as far as return on investment.

Speaker 2: 1:40

But I went down the business line, so I spent the little money that I had saved up, poured that into a business and then, as time's gone on, I've saved up some more money, got to a point where I thought a business, a house, was possible for my future with KiwiSaver and Air as well and went to probably three or four different mortgage brokers and they all just went let's see your business profit and loss, let's see this jump through more hoops than just the average person on wages. And they all came back and said, no, this is as much as we can lend you, which wouldn't have even got me like a garage in Pram, let alone a house. So I sort of gave up and my now wife actually gave me your name and I said, nah, can't be bothered with this, it's just going to be another. No, and she goes look, just one more try. So you were our last try.

Speaker 1: 2:36

Wow, I didn't know that. I thought you went to maybe one person before me, but I didn't know that I was actually your last try.

Speaker 2: 2:41

Yeah, we had a few, because I hadn't even heard of you yet.

Speaker 1: 2:45

It was just the beginning of my career at that point as well. I think I'd just got my business and I was just starting out.

Speaker 2: 2:51

Yeah, so it was perfect timing. Thank you for coming along when you did, because, yeah, I had really given up and I was sort of like, oh, do we just sell the business and then go over to Australia like everybody else, or do we keep trying? Yeah, so I gave you a try and straight away you were like yeah easy, we can get you this.

Speaker 2: 3:10

Or if you can just save up just a little bit longer, we can get you this. Or if you can just save up just a little bit longer, we can get you this. And I was like, oh wow, this is actually a reality now. So it went from no hope at all to having a house. Really, um getting beaten down by everyone else, and then come to you and full of hope again and uh, yeah, you got us across the line for our house that we're in now. It's a little glorified batch in.

Speaker 1: 3:31

Tihura, so very happy there yeah, what are your future plans?

Speaker 2: 3:37

uh, so cutting it out at the moment with nice spa pool in the backyard. So we're talking over the weekend about it, saying how nice it would be as an Airbnb. So, depending on where we're going to be in the future, we want to buy upgrade For kids coming along. It's going to be a pretty small house. It's a small house now, but it's going to be even smaller with a couple of little ones there. So we want to upgrade, but we're either going to sell that to buy the new place or hopefully have enough money and capital to buy a new place and then rent that one out.

Speaker 1: 4:12

And that's the beauty of it, isn't it? When you get into the property market, when you take that first step, at least you're in. The first step is the hardest.

Speaker 2: 4:20

Yeah, absolutely.

Speaker 1: 4:22

And it doesn't have to be your forever home.

Speaker 2: 4:24

No, no, and that's what I made sure of. I was very realistic, Obviously still looking at the $2 million houses and dreaming of what if I won lotto or came across all this money, but realistically going all right, this is affordable and if interest rates go up by a few percent, I'm not going to be going into forfeit or anything like that.

Speaker 1: 4:44

And I think and that's the conversation we had with you at that point, wasn't it that be realistic, buy what you can afford and then from there, you know, a few years later down the track we'll reassess again and see what else you can get in.

Speaker 2: 4:56

Yeah, absolutely.

Speaker 1: 4:57

Yeah, because you can buy another property based on the equity of this one. Or, as you say, you know at least if you sell and if you sell right now in the market that we're in it's an interesting time If you buy and sell really quick, then you should be able to get that better property for not as much.

Speaker 2: 5:15

Yeah, the way I look at it, you're always buying and selling in the same market. So even if your property goes up by even a million dollars, the next house you buy is going to be a million dollars more, most likely too, but obviously the interest in your mortgage is not going to be that million dollars extra. So that's when it works out.

Speaker 1: 5:36

Yeah, but it would have been much harder if you waited all this time.

Speaker 2: 5:39

Oh, absolutely. I hate looking at my mortgage as it is, when you're paying $1,200 a fortnight and then only seeing maybe $150 come off of the mortgage. But I can only imagine what people with a million dollar mortgage must be feeling. Yeah, especially when they're it in COVID times yeah when things went a little bit too crazy well, that's when I did buy, if you remember you yeah, I was just trying to remember.

Speaker 2: 6:02

I think it was right before it hit yeah the craziness um, so you got us across the line. We were just waiting on the bank to confirm and say everything. And then I got the phone call from I can't remember if it was you or the bank about an hour after just under announced we were going into lockdown yeah, I remember it was like right around that crazy, crazy time, but then shortly after that's when the properties catapulted yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2: 6:27

So we were stoked that we were locked in the guy we were buying off because it was a private sale. He wasn't as stoked that the prices had skyrocketed after we were locked in there.

Speaker 1: 6:36

Because I think you made like 100K on a property within a year because the prices just went.

Speaker 2: 6:41

Yeah, and I was like, oh my God, I wouldn't have brought this for this much money.

Speaker 1: 6:44

Yeah, and I think we talked about that as well. Yeah, because I remember I was pregnant at the time and went into lockdown and I was craving the donuts with cream and you came to my rescue. I remember messaging you going, Ben, can you do a drop off? So that was a really good client to have.

Speaker 2: 7:02

Yeah, those were interesting times, that's for sure.

Speaker 1: 7:04

Yeah, and you pivoted right with your business. You had to pivot really fast, so do you want to talk a little bit about that journey as well, on how, what did you do with your business?

Speaker 2: 7:13

Yeah, want to talk a little bit about that journey as well, on how, um, what did you do with your business? Yep, so, for the original lockdown the first one, we were, just like everybody else, stuck at home. Unfortunately, because of the lockdown, we couldn't move into the new house, so we were just in a little granny flat that we're staying in. So it was quite difficult, but because of that we knew we were going to last as a couple. You know, not a house not much bigger than this room we're in now. So that was a good test for us. And then that gave me time to sort of work on the business, which I hadn't been able to do up until that point, because I was just busy with work.

Speaker 2: 7:46

And then we came out of the level four lockdowns with all the restrictions, so we were allowed to open, but not as we knew or had been the whole time, so it was contactless deliveries yeah so I turned into a baker slash courier driver, which was good fun because I'd always hit if I gave up on baking. Maybe courier driving could be an option it was a good test run I think I lasted half a day before I was like look at this, Hats off to careers.

Speaker 1: 8:14

So career driving is not the option.

Speaker 2: 8:16

People are really bad drivers and when you're just driving from point A to point B you sort of get a little bit frustrated. But when you're doing, you know, I think the most deliveries we had in a day was like 180. And I was the one doing all the deliveries. So it got to the point where I think delivery 89 or something, someone would pull out in front of you and you just couldn't be like, oh, it's fine, and I'm a pretty calm person most of the time, and so for me to really get going takes a lot. And yeah, I was like I'm only a day or two into this and I'm already getting this frustrated. I could not do this for a living.

Speaker 1: 8:52

Yeah.

Speaker 2: 8:55

And and I'm already getting this frustrated I could not do this for a living. Yeah, and I mean, the roads were probably clear as well, not as busy. Yeah, you'd be surprised, they were pretty clear and busy. But you know, I think all the idiots still just went out and did their normal thing, because it was just as much road rage as normal, except more stressed out, and I was on the road more.

Speaker 1: 9:10

Yeah, okay, and in terms of your business, where do you see yourself going, because obviously it may not be sustainable being a baker full time. What hours do you do? I remember you do crazy hours. Do you want to share that?

Speaker 2: 9:24

So usually starting around midnight, 1 am and going through until good normal days about 8 or 9 am. This week I've had staff away so I've been covering some of the shifts I've been doing midnight till about 1 or 2 pm.

Speaker 1: 9:39

Wow.

Speaker 2: 9:40

Yeah, and then deliveries after that for our wholesale clients. So it's pretty crazy hours, but when it's all going good, I get to start at midnight, finish at 8, get around to golfing If it's sunny go for a swim at the river or go see friends for lunch and then go to sleep. Obviously very early, but it's worth it in my books.

Speaker 1: 10:02

But that won't be sustainable once you guys have kids, right? So what's your big picture, or do you think it will be fine?

Speaker 2: 10:08

So the reason I got into baking and I like to share this story because it was just my aha moment of I didn't know what I wanted to do and then I knew what I wanted to do my first job was at New World, just helping out in the bakery. I had no intentions of being a baker, it just happened to work that way. And the guy I worked with there I'd turn up at 6 am. He'd been there since 2 or 3 am and every morning it would be Good morning, ben, how are you All happy? I've never seen anyone in the workplace that happy and I just didn't understand it.

Speaker 2: 10:40

So I asked him one morning. I said why are you so happy? He goes, mate. I get to come in make beautiful food I'm not surrounded by people that annoy me all the time and then once I finish work I get to go home, have a little sleep, pick my kids up from school, and I get to spend the afternoon with them and do all that sort of thing. And I was like, oh, that sounds like a good life.

Speaker 1: 10:58

Okay, actually, yeah, you just opened my eyes to that whole dynamic. So maybe, yeah, it does work that way.

Speaker 2: 11:04

Yeah, and the hours I start and do, and with it being my own business, I can sort of work it most of the time so that it works in my favor. So the plan is I should be able to go to work, get home, drop the kids off at school, go out for a round of golf or go have a sleep, go pick the kids up after school, take them to sports practice, do whatever.

Speaker 1: 11:27

I love how golf is like a predominant thing in your life. You keep mentioning golf. Is it because we're sitting here and the golf is right?

Speaker 2: 11:36

Yeah, yeah, and it's been a couple of days so I'm getting the withdrawals. You know, no, golf's my time. The phone goes off. I'm not thinking about the business at all. We're coming up 10 years for the bakery, so it's been a massive Wow.

Speaker 1: 11:50

Has it been 10 years? Yeah, Almost.

Speaker 2: 11:53

End of January 10 years, Wow. So that's been a big part of my life. So just to be able to switch off from it and just focus on just being out in the sun with good mates and having a good time. Most of the time when the golf's going good.

Speaker 1: 12:07

Oh, I thought you meant most of the good friends. Sometimes they're not good friends.

Speaker 2: 12:10

Yeah, sometimes not, that's awesome.

Speaker 1: 12:14

Actually, you just reminded me of a story, so do you want to tell me the story? When you went playing golf with someone recently and they lost you a bet?

Speaker 2: 12:21

Yes. So one of my mates that I play golf with. He got offered a really good opportunity to buy some property and went through a few mortgage brokers and every week, oh, how'd that go? No, it didn't work. Oh, see, zeb and Aso, she'll sort you out. No, I'll try this other mortgage broker.

Speaker 2: 12:38

And that kept going on loop for a while until we're having beers one time after golf and said, oh, how's it all going? He goes oh, I give up, there's no point, no one's gonna, uh, sign us off on this. And I said, just try zeb and aso. Nah, no point, just dead against it. And I said, right, 500 bucks if she says no and can't get across the line, but if she can, you owe me $2,000. So in his head he's going oh, I'm going to make an easy $500 because I'm not going to get across the line. And I'm going yes, I've just made $2,000 because I know how much of a weapon you are and you'll see a challenge and go right, this is me. So I was very happy with that and it's a good example to anyone else that I send you away. When they go, oh, no. And I go oh, do you want to bet?

Speaker 1: 13:23

So did you actually make $2,000?

Speaker 2: 13:26

I could he offered me $2,000, or he provides a few services that will really help the business. And so he offered $2,000, probably ends up being a lot more than $2,000 worth of services for that.

Speaker 1: 13:40

So he lost. He lost, yes, it was really interesting, you know, when he came to me and he said look, ben told me to get in touch with you. We've been to a few people. They said, no, you're probably going to say no.

Speaker 1: 13:54

When I met with them, at each other going, she just gave us a solution that we've been asking other brokers to look at and nobody did. And to me again, I mean, I don't think I do anything special. Let's put it that way I don't think I'm anything special. I'm just an ordinary human. Go around my day trying to do my best, and moments like this remind me that when you try to do just a little bit extra for people, it's amazing how much difference it makes absolutely, and I think with you I'm incorrect if I'm wrong, but I think a lot of people just get complacent and go right, this is easy.

Speaker 2: 14:29

If I get this come through, I sign, I say yes. If if it comes through and it's not above this line, I say no, whereas you go. Well, there's a little bit of wiggle room there. Actually, we probably could get this through the line if this person just does this and so just taking that one extra step, so a lot of people. It would seem like nothing, but to your clients I know for sure, being one of them, that one extra step is literally life-changing.

Speaker 1: 14:52

Thank you you. Just honestly. I feel very emotional right now because it's been a while since, you know, we've talked, we've dealt in the professional matter and to hear that still coming through four years later and, you know, to feel the genuine feelings that you've got coming out of you, it just reminds me of why I do my job. You know why every day I wake up Because our job is stressful. Don't get me wrong. You know there are things constantly going. People you know about to lose a deal or something's happening and you need to jump on it really fast. So hearing this and I never hear this back from people right going, oh, thank you so much, it's just sort of they get the keys. They're like, yep, sweet Thank you. From people right going oh, thank you so much.

Speaker 1: 15:37

It's just sort of they get the keys, they're like, yep, sweet, thank you. See, ya, and I don't see them for another year or two until the refix comes up. But to actually sit down and talk to people openly about how they feel and how it went for them and to see the other side, it makes me happy.

Speaker 2: 15:50

I bet, yeah, that's what gets me like I won't. I just can't let someone do me such a huge favor and impact my life so much and have them not know that that's what's happened, because, as I said, like you don't even think about well, as you said, you don't even think about the extra steps you go through, it's just what you do, but people need to tell you, like that's what makes the difference. That is life changing for so many people. Yeah, it's incredible that's awesome.

Speaker 2: 16:21

Thank you, ben and then, as what I just picked up on before, those so many people use you for your services and then go oh thanks, oh, we'll get in touch in three years or five years when we refix, but I get all of my insurance as soon as any insurance or anything like that comes through. I'm straight First order's right. I guarantee you Zeb and Isa can know someone that can beat this or the circle you've built up. You're not just mortgage. You can give so much advice and help in the whole aspect of things.

Speaker 1: 16:52

And I'm free.

Speaker 2: 16:53

And you're free. Exactly, you don't cost any money. I don't even cost any money.

Speaker 1: 16:58

I don't cost any money. I don't even cost any money. I don't cost any money. I just ask for buns.

Speaker 2: 16:59

Yeah, well, I can do those. It's a small price to pay.

Speaker 1: 17:03

So tell me the story behind Ben's Buns. Why did you call it Ben's Buns, apart from it ringing a nice bell?

Speaker 2: 17:10

So I was 15 when I decided I wanted to be a baker, immature, and that was the first name I came up with and it sort of just stuck.

Speaker 1: 17:21

Okay, yeah, and what is your bakery famous for?

Speaker 2: 17:26

Our Chelsea and Raspberry buns are a massive hit. Hindsight's a wonderful thing. I would have called it something pies, because our pies have gone from selling maybe 30 a day tops to about 150 to 200 a day, that's a lot of pies, yeah. So pies are probably the main thing as far as the general customer is concerned, and then wholesale to cafes and restaurants. We do a lot of buns and loaves.

Speaker 1: 17:55

So you bake your own bread as well, right?

Speaker 2: 17:57

yep, everything's all baked from scratch how many bakers do you have? Just me and one other. At the moment, we had an apprentice who had a few like health issues, like the gluten was affecting her skin, so she left, which was perfect timing because, as everybody knows, it's not exactly the climate to be making money at the moment.

Speaker 2: 18:21

So all of our prices have just skyrocketed. So it worked out well. I didn't have to get rid of anyone, I didn't have to reduce any hours. It just smoothed out perfectly and now we're in. Doesn't look like it outside, but we're in the summer uh months now. So with the sunshine and the heat, a lot more people come down to the beach, which means more people through the door, more money to spend on things in the bakery.

Speaker 1: 18:44

Well, I'll give you some free promotion here, ben. So do you want to tell people where to find you? Because you mentioned the beach, you mentioned the name, but where do people actually find you? You know socials, et cetera.

Speaker 2: 18:55

So we are located on McLean Street, 3a, mclean Street, paraparauma Beach. You can find us down there seven days a week, pretty much, if you see the lights on. If the door's not open, just knock on the window and we'll sort you out. Otherwise, you can find us on Facebook at BenzBunsNZ, instagram BenzBunsNZ. We've got a TikTok with like four TikToks on it. Eventually I'll get around to that. Definitely, tiktoks made me feel like I'm in my 30s.

Speaker 1: 19:26

Yep same. I struggle daily. I have to force myself to go on TikTok.

Speaker 2: 19:31

Yeah, I mean I'm bad with the Facebook and Instagram side of things as well. I'm just really bad at sharing our stuff, like we just did 2,000 buns for the Kapiti Half Marathon, which was our own little marathon in there. It was five hours of baking buns and then four hours of icing buns, and it wasn't until we iced the last bun where I thought we should have set up a camera in here and time-lapsed all this yeah.

Speaker 1: 19:54

That would have been a cool video. Yeah, all this, yeah, but that would have been a cool video, yeah, okay, so, um, what I want to ask you next is a couple of questions. I've been asking people as they come on this, just to make it a bit of a regular thing. But you did mention through our conversation, so we're just going to wrap it up and I'm going to throw them back at you. Um, what gets you out of bed, apart from the buns?

Speaker 2: 20:15

uh, yeah, my alarm clock. Um, what gets me out of bed? Just the joy to be alive and fit and well not fit, but you know, fitter than someone that can't get out of bed. Um, and reasonably healthy. Uh, getting to see the sunshine. Like the best part about being a baker is you get to watch sunrise every morning. Uh, when's time you get to watch sunset? I'm asleep in the summertime before the sun sets. Um, but yeah, just just life. It's time you get to watch sunset. I'm asleep in the summertime before the sunset. But, yeah, just life. It's good. What keeps you positive?

Speaker 2: 20:44

Positive, despite everything that's been hard this year especially. There's just uh how. What keeps me positive? Golf, golf. Oh ask anyone, I play golf with nine times out of ten that does not end up positive at the end. The bears afterwards do uh well, no, just I know that everything's gonna work out, you know, you just gotta have faith that everything's gonna work. I'm not religious or anything, but I just know that if you keep working hard and you're doing the right things and not doing bad things or bad to people, then everything will work out.

Speaker 1: 21:20

Yeah, that's really cool. You know, yesterday I just heard this phrase of be kind right, If you've got nothing to give to someone, you've got kindness to give.

Speaker 2: 21:31

Yes.

Speaker 1: 21:32

Like it doesn't have to be a material thing, but leave every person that you've met better than when you found them.

Speaker 2: 21:39

Yeah, I agree with that whole utterly, and that's yeah. When people say, oh, I can't do anything for anyone, yeah, you can. All you've got to do is say hello to them, spark a conversation with someone. That could be the thing that makes their day.

Speaker 1: 21:50

Yeah.

Speaker 2: 21:50

Someone sitting at a bus stop. All you need to say is hi, and that could be the highlight of their day. You just don't know what other people are going through.

Speaker 1: 22:01

I think these days we live in such a materialistic world that people put too much pressure on material things and when they say, you know, I can't do something for someone, they're thinking probably, oh, I can't buy them wine or flowers or you know, or take them out for dinner.

Speaker 2: 22:12

Take them out for dinner.

Speaker 1: 22:13

But actually, as you say, just say hello.

Speaker 2: 22:16

Yeah.

Speaker 1: 22:16

Be a nice human. Yeah, doesn't cost much.

Speaker 2: 22:19

No, and it doesn't happen enough in this world unfortunately.

Speaker 1: 22:23

What's your favorite beverage?

Speaker 2: 22:25

Beverage oh, it's any cold beer, any cold beer, or most whiskeys and bourbons.

Speaker 1: 22:34

Okay, what's your current like the most special pie that you've created for your bakery? Is there one that you've created out of your own head?

Speaker 2: 22:46

So we've got just our normal standard range and then all of our specialty pies. It's all. Just you say head, it's all from the belly.

Speaker 1: 22:57

They say never trust a skinny baker.

Speaker 2: 22:59

Exactly so. That's why I've never lost my belly.

Speaker 2: 23:02

So keep it. Probably it's our creamy mushroom pie. So we've got four different variations of that. Now We've got our vegetarian one which is creamy mushrooms and caramelised onion, and then I added some diced crankski to that, so creamy mushroom and caramelized onion, uh. And then I added some dice crank ski to that, so creamy mushroom and crank ski pie, because it needs meat in my opinion. And then our steak and mushroom is the same creamy mush, garlic creamy mushroom on top of that. And then now we now have a chicken and mushroom one which is that creamy mushroom but with chicken spiced chicken thigh mix through that. So I think it might not be the best, but it's definitely the most universal and it's gets the biggest tick from all of our customers because, yeah, I remember you had a kransky pie yes, that's the creamy mushroom.

Speaker 2: 23:45

Is it the creamy?

Speaker 1: 23:46

mushroom. I'm sure there was another separate one that we have a kransky just rolled in pastry. Yes, that's the one. Yeah, because your bakery is my go-to, usually On Saturdays with the kids. So when I go to the market that's my go-to get the food. It's funny because there's like a market full of food and the kids go no, we're going to go to that bakery, that's our go-to, but every time I go you're not there.

Speaker 2: 24:10

Yeah, well on the Saturdays Up until recently, where I've brought some new equipment and figured out some better ways at producing stuff a lot faster. I had been starting at about 9 pm on the Friday night and then going through to about 8 or 9 am. But normally if you see me at the bakery after about 8 or 9 am it's because something hasn't gone right, whether that be someone's away or we've stuffed up a batch of something and had to redo it. I'm usually I call them vampire hours. I go in when the sun sets and I'm gone by the time it rises.

Speaker 1: 24:45

Okay, otherwise you shine. Yeah, yeah, beautiful Ben, thank you so much for coming along. It was an absolute pleasure to have you today and share just a glimpse of the journey that you had and the hope and I hope listeners today took away some key Well if they take away anything, it's that Zeb and Esau is your person for mortgages to sort it out. Thank you.

Speaker 2: 25:11

And if you're thinking about it and you go oh, maybe I should contact Zeb and Esau, just do it, Because if you're not ready, she'll find a way for you to be ready.

Speaker 1: 25:21

That just like turned into promotion for me, so thank you. Thank you, ben, absolutely appreciate it. Enjoy the rest of your day and I hope you'll get some better weather for golf.

Speaker 2: 25:29

Yes, thank you for having me. I'm off to sleep now.

Speaker 1: 25:32

Thank you for staying awake.